Comments on: The DA, social media and the masses http://nicharalambous.com/2009/02/23/the-da-social-media-and-the-masses/ onlinemobilecitizensocialmediaandmore Sat, 06 Feb 2010 06:42:00 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: wikidknickers » THE DA WEBSITE - MY TWO CENTS http://nicharalambous.com/2009/02/23/the-da-social-media-and-the-masses/comment-page-1/#comment-10569 wikidknickers » THE DA WEBSITE - MY TWO CENTS Sun, 10 May 2009 18:15:29 +0000 http://nicharalambous.com/?p=1822#comment-10569 [...] (self named?), bloggers and geeks whom I all love very much, but some of whom (as Melissa said on Nic’s post) “are so far up there arses that they are out there to slam and test and poke holes in any [...] [...] (self named?), bloggers and geeks whom I all love very much, but some of whom (as Melissa said on Nic’s post) “are so far up there arses that they are out there to slam and test and poke holes in any [...]

]]> By: supercopygurl http://nicharalambous.com/2009/02/23/the-da-social-media-and-the-masses/comment-page-1/#comment-10354 supercopygurl Tue, 24 Feb 2009 11:09:26 +0000 http://nicharalambous.com/?p=1822#comment-10354 I still feel its a little too late, maybe the campaign would matter if it were launched a tad earlier. Also, are the DA going the smart route with SM? Aren't the votes that need to be converted offline. I dunno, I like the idea, I like the plan. The timing is lacking. I still feel its a little too late, maybe the campaign would matter if it were launched a tad earlier. Also, are the DA going the smart route with SM? Aren’t the votes that need to be converted offline. I dunno, I like the idea, I like the plan. The timing is lacking.

]]> By: matt http://nicharalambous.com/2009/02/23/the-da-social-media-and-the-masses/comment-page-1/#comment-10352 matt Tue, 24 Feb 2009 08:10:31 +0000 http://nicharalambous.com/?p=1822#comment-10352 hmmmmmmmm :-) hmmmmmmmm :-)

]]> By: Nic http://nicharalambous.com/2009/02/23/the-da-social-media-and-the-masses/comment-page-1/#comment-10351 Nic Tue, 24 Feb 2009 08:00:34 +0000 http://nicharalambous.com/?p=1822#comment-10351 No Matt, we're not having that argument, we have moved on, that wasn't my focus of the post. My focus was the following in summation: Social media is cutting edge, relevant and important enough to be in the space, active and engaging. Yet I am not going to be bleak when Helen Zille doesn't @reply to my tweet because I think that she has better things to do than respond to me. In fact, I HOPE she has better things to do than respond to my tweet. If she didn't, I'd be confused. Lastly, you are preaching to the converted Matt, I know that online is the way forward and the shining light so to speak. It's strange how our roles have reversed, normally you are the one stating that online will not kill print! - that was a joke. It's interesting to me looking through this whole thread how many people commenting on the post interpreted what I said in many different ways and then shifted the discussion towards that topic. I think that many were right and it's been a great debate so far. But you're right Matt, online is not more significant (even if I said that) than other mediums, nor is mobile and with the DA winning just under 2m votes in the last elections maybe they should begin to target the 5m people online and win every one of those votes... but as we've both agreed, that wont happen in two months. No Matt, we’re not having that argument, we have moved on, that wasn’t my focus of the post. My focus was the following in summation: Social media is cutting edge, relevant and important enough to be in the space, active and engaging. Yet I am not going to be bleak when Helen Zille doesn’t @reply to my tweet because I think that she has better things to do than respond to me. In fact, I HOPE she has better things to do than respond to my tweet. If she didn’t, I’d be confused.

Lastly, you are preaching to the converted Matt, I know that online is the way forward and the shining light so to speak. It’s strange how our roles have reversed, normally you are the one stating that online will not kill print! – that was a joke.

It’s interesting to me looking through this whole thread how many people commenting on the post interpreted what I said in many different ways and then shifted the discussion towards that topic. I think that many were right and it’s been a great debate so far.

But you’re right Matt, online is not more significant (even if I said that) than other mediums, nor is mobile and with the DA winning just under 2m votes in the last elections maybe they should begin to target the 5m people online and win every one of those votes… but as we’ve both agreed, that wont happen in two months.

]]> By: matt http://nicharalambous.com/2009/02/23/the-da-social-media-and-the-masses/comment-page-1/#comment-10350 matt Tue, 24 Feb 2009 07:50:05 +0000 http://nicharalambous.com/?p=1822#comment-10350 Who knows what the penetration is on that 16m? My point is that when viewing the actual size of the electorate, than say the overall population figure that the picture changes. That's my point. By the way the ANC received just over 10m votes and the DA just under 2m votes in last year's elections: http://www.elections.org.za/Elections2004_static.asp I'd be interested to argue with anyone who thinks either of these parties can ignore not only an online audience, but a mobile audience too. Mobile is often held out as promise to a bigger audience, but remember it's dominated by youth (many non voters) and by the networks and handset makers. And who said online was "more significant" than other mediums? (Well you did, actually -- I didn't). Obviously you look at it in context of the electorate and other mediums too. And there you go mentioning the "48m potential voters" figure again. (They are not "potential voters", cos 48m aren't voting in THIS election.) I'm a bit baffled why we're still having these irrelevant debates about whether the medium is significant or not. Not quite sure why this is still an argument actually -- I thought we'd moved on (Well I had). Who knows what the penetration is on that 16m? My point is that when viewing the actual size of the electorate, than say the overall population figure that the picture changes. That’s my point.

By the way the ANC received just over 10m votes and the DA just under 2m votes in last year’s elections: http://www.elections.org.za/Elections2004_static.asp

I’d be interested to argue with anyone who thinks either of these parties can ignore not only an online audience, but a mobile audience too. Mobile is often held out as promise to a bigger audience, but remember it’s dominated by youth (many non voters) and by the networks and handset makers.

And who said online was “more significant” than other mediums? (Well you did, actually — I didn’t). Obviously you look at it in context of the electorate and other mediums too. And there you go mentioning the “48m potential voters” figure again. (They are not “potential voters”, cos 48m aren’t voting in THIS election.)

I’m a bit baffled why we’re still having these irrelevant debates about whether the medium is significant or not. Not quite sure why this is still an argument actually — I thought we’d moved on (Well I had).

]]> By: Nic http://nicharalambous.com/2009/02/23/the-da-social-media-and-the-masses/comment-page-1/#comment-10349 Nic Tue, 24 Feb 2009 07:35:25 +0000 http://nicharalambous.com/?p=1822#comment-10349 Hey Matt - As I said, I stand to be corrected but I don't think that you have done a particularly good job of correcting me however. OK so we take down the population of ±48m to a voting population of ±16m. Can you tell me of those 16m VOTERS how many have internet via PC or use their cellphones to access the internet? If you can give me those numbers then I concede your point. But to even think that there are 5million South Africans with Broadband access capable of actually interacting sufficiently with the DA's campaign online via PC, not mobile, is a bit mislead. Do you honestly think that the campaign has effectively targeted 100 000 never mind the 5m you say are potentially out there? I really struggle to agree that the online portion of the campaign is more significant than, say, the mobile campaign that should be active or even, dare I say it, the above the line marketing or on the ground marketing. 48m potential voters, 5m online... 43m marginalised if online is seen as significant over or adjacent to other campaigns. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying drop the ball with online AT ALL. I am saying that the "observers" online need to keep mindful of the greater context of SA. The greater context is not online. In fact even to say that a minority is online is an overstatement for the time being, it's less than a minority. One thing we agree on Matt is that this campaign could have been a whole helluva lot more effective if it was launched about a year ago and built upon, listen to, spoken with and interacted with. But a two month "flash campaign" online is probably not going to serve a great purpose any which way. Hey Matt – As I said, I stand to be corrected but I don’t think that you have done a particularly good job of correcting me however. OK so we take down the population of ±48m to a voting population of ±16m. Can you tell me of those 16m VOTERS how many have internet via PC or use their cellphones to access the internet? If you can give me those numbers then I concede your point. But to even think that there are 5million South Africans with Broadband access capable of actually interacting sufficiently with the DA’s campaign online via PC, not mobile, is a bit mislead. Do you honestly think that the campaign has effectively targeted 100 000 never mind the 5m you say are potentially out there?

I really struggle to agree that the online portion of the campaign is more significant than, say, the mobile campaign that should be active or even, dare I say it, the above the line marketing or on the ground marketing. 48m potential voters, 5m online… 43m marginalised if online is seen as significant over or adjacent to other campaigns.

Don’t get me wrong, I’m not saying drop the ball with online AT ALL. I am saying that the “observers” online need to keep mindful of the greater context of SA. The greater context is not online. In fact even to say that a minority is online is an overstatement for the time being, it’s less than a minority.

One thing we agree on Matt is that this campaign could have been a whole helluva lot more effective if it was launched about a year ago and built upon, listen to, spoken with and interacted with. But a two month “flash campaign” online is probably not going to serve a great purpose any which way.

]]> By: matt http://nicharalambous.com/2009/02/23/the-da-social-media-and-the-masses/comment-page-1/#comment-10348 matt Tue, 24 Feb 2009 07:23:33 +0000 http://nicharalambous.com/?p=1822#comment-10348 Eish Nic, your thumbsucking, guessing numbers don't really make a strong argument. I'm looking for something a bit more nuanced than the same old mantra that talks about how small the net is and we shouldn't bother (etc etc, blah blah) -- we've been hearing that for the past 10 years. I'm also looking for analysis that's a bit less obvious than "we're not the same as the US". :-) I think I make a pretty good point when we compare the internet audience size and mobile audience size with that of the actual electorate (only 16m). You could argue internet penetration is higher in this case. Will also be interesting to see how many votes the ANC and the DA actually got too? Furthermore, what party can afford to ignore 5-million votes, never mind even 100 000 votes. The DA's site won't be that effective, possibly because I think they missed a few tricks around functionality, and they're launching it two months before the elections(!!) I guess they could argue that it's an investment for many years to come. So I beg to differ with you that it's "relatively insignificant". I think it's pretty significant that they're a political party engaging with social media and social networks like this (for better or for worse) -- and I think that's worthy of comment. PS: I blogged about the ANC SM launch too :-) Eish Nic, your thumbsucking, guessing numbers don’t really make a strong argument. I’m looking for something a bit more nuanced than the same old mantra that talks about how small the net is and we shouldn’t bother (etc etc, blah blah) — we’ve been hearing that for the past 10 years. I’m also looking for analysis that’s a bit less obvious than “we’re not the same as the US”. :-)

I think I make a pretty good point when we compare the internet audience size and mobile audience size with that of the actual electorate (only 16m). You could argue internet penetration is higher in this case. Will also be interesting to see how many votes the ANC and the DA actually got too? Furthermore, what party can afford to ignore 5-million votes, never mind even 100 000 votes.

The DA’s site won’t be that effective, possibly because I think they missed a few tricks around functionality, and they’re launching it two months before the elections(!!) I guess they could argue that it’s an investment for many years to come.

So I beg to differ with you that it’s “relatively insignificant”. I think it’s pretty significant that they’re a political party engaging with social media and social networks like this (for better or for worse) — and I think that’s worthy of comment.

PS: I blogged about the ANC SM launch too :-)

]]> By: Wogan http://nicharalambous.com/2009/02/23/the-da-social-media-and-the-masses/comment-page-1/#comment-10346 Wogan Tue, 24 Feb 2009 06:20:08 +0000 http://nicharalambous.com/?p=1822#comment-10346 It seems that this is still relevant: http://href.co.za/212 I'm sure the DA realises that they're not going to win this election based on their SM strategy. Currently, their main facebook group has ~12'500 members - that's less than 2% of the total SA userbase on Facebook. I definitely agree with Nic - it's nice to have them respond to our emails and tweets and blog posts, but damnit, there are more important things to do than take the time to stroke our egos. In case no-one's noticed, the country's kinda falling apart, and I'd much rather have them attacking that problem than spend time wondering how to title a blog post for maximum retweet value. So instead of all this petty bashing (which really just equates to a lot of hot air, and doesn't change a thing), can't we rather work <em>with</em> the DA (flawed as their SM strategy is), and in our own ways help to make it better? Or are we really <em>that</em> pathetic? It seems that this is still relevant: http://href.co.za/212

I’m sure the DA realises that they’re not going to win this election based on their SM strategy. Currently, their main facebook group has ~12′500 members – that’s less than 2% of the total SA userbase on Facebook.

I definitely agree with Nic – it’s nice to have them respond to our emails and tweets and blog posts, but damnit, there are more important things to do than take the time to stroke our egos. In case no-one’s noticed, the country’s kinda falling apart, and I’d much rather have them attacking that problem than spend time wondering how to title a blog post for maximum retweet value.

So instead of all this petty bashing (which really just equates to a lot of hot air, and doesn’t change a thing), can’t we rather work with the DA (flawed as their SM strategy is), and in our own ways help to make it better?

Or are we really that pathetic?

]]> By: DA, gurus and the online circus | FeistyFemale http://nicharalambous.com/2009/02/23/the-da-social-media-and-the-masses/comment-page-1/#comment-10343 DA, gurus and the online circus | FeistyFemale Mon, 23 Feb 2009 11:29:34 +0000 http://nicharalambous.com/?p=1822#comment-10343 [...] I did want to comment and agree with the brilliant Nic (voice of reason, rational being with a no-nonsense approach). The man has an uncanny way of saying [...] [...] I did want to comment and agree with the brilliant Nic (voice of reason, rational being with a no-nonsense approach). The man has an uncanny way of saying [...]

]]> By: FlintZA http://nicharalambous.com/2009/02/23/the-da-social-media-and-the-masses/comment-page-1/#comment-10342 FlintZA Mon, 23 Feb 2009 10:20:30 +0000 http://nicharalambous.com/?p=1822#comment-10342 Interesting post. I wasn't aware the DA was getting flamed in any way for their campaign. I for one like what they're doing because they are communicating in a way that is convenient for me. I think it's fantastic that social media is part of their campaign, what concerns me is what percentage of their marketing campaign is being spent on social media 'experts' to utilize the medium. As you pointed out those of us active on social media are a really small percentage of the population-certainly not enough to give them any kind of significant advantage in the elections. I only hope they are spending a far larger portion of their budget on tv, radio and print marketing than they spent on Facebook, Twitter and their new website. Interesting post. I wasn’t aware the DA was getting flamed in any way for their campaign.
I for one like what they’re doing because they are communicating in a way that is convenient for me. I think it’s fantastic that social media is part of their campaign, what concerns me is what percentage of their marketing campaign is being spent on social media ‘experts’ to utilize the medium. As you pointed out those of us active on social media are a really small percentage of the population-certainly not enough to give them any kind of significant advantage in the elections. I only hope they are spending a far larger portion of their budget on tv, radio and print marketing than they spent on Facebook, Twitter and their new website.

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